http://www.ohioccw.org/files/JoeBusinessletter.pdf

windex1 Said,
“What would you do if the owner told you that he and his staff were heavily armed ”

Are you? Because you were real quick to have gun-owners carry insurance and have us, basically, be law experts (carry the responsibility) when you have very little research on the topic at hand.

Rephasing the debate an THEIR terms is not manipulation.

Every time I use the “I’m not going to spend any money anywhere that denies me the courtesy of respecting my state-sanctioned right to carry a firearm.” The reply is a usually rude take on “Good, we don’t want your business!”

BTW, is is a God-given right.

How will they find out? Well, I’m pretty certain that anti-gunners frequent gun blogs just like we frequent theirs…you just told them.

Even if no one ever does it, you can bet we’ll be accused of it. And every time we point out their use of subterfuge, they’ll be able to point to this and say “see, your side does it too”.

Thanks. That aught to make convincing the fence sitters easier. “We’re all a bunch of liars with no integrity, but you shouldn’t have a problem with us carrying guns around all day.”

Yup…that’ll work great.

Of course, if we ARE a bunch of liars with no integrity, I’m not so sure we SHOULD be carrying guns around all day.

How do you square this approach with your thoughts on Open Carry?

It seems if we should take a balanced approach and not do anything that might produce a backlash regarding Open Carry isn’t a little ironic that you are propose doing something could cast doubts on the integrity and honesty of 2nd amendment advocates?

I like that. If I ever open a restaurant, I may have to post a “No Guns, No Service” sign. :-D

“Considering that the law looks at “premises liability,” I and every other business should be taking responsibility. ”

So either way you’re dammed. Especially if you said that you and your employee’s are heavily armed and then it turns out that’s not the case. It’s like those fake security cameras that don’t actually record anything. They can get you in a lot of trouble if something happens.

“My rights trump yours in my place of business!”

I’ll agree with that up to a point. Try posting a “no blacks allowed” sign in your business window and see how long your rights trump.

After all, the only places where I see “Do Not Cross When Flooded” signs around here are in washes that get a heck of a lot of water when there’s a flood, and you don’t see a heck of a lot of “Watch for Falling Rock” signs in the middle of the Nebraska prairies.

If there’s a danger out there, someone will probably put up a sign warning us of it. And if a given bar owner thinks his patrons are incapable (for whatever reason) of safely carrying a concealed weapon, there’s a good chance his fears are justified, and therefore, that’s a place that I don’t want to frequent no matter what the circumstances.

I suppose you can add guns to that.

If restaurants aren’t going to serve you without shoes or a shirt, don’t worry your pretty little head that they are somehow going to be bothered by the fact you can’t carry your gun inside.

Considering that the law looks at “premises liability,” I and every other business should be taking responsibility.

Walmart lost a $4.2 million dollar case in a shooting. How many of those do you think they can lose before Walmart closes their doors and says “We don’t want to be in your community.”

I don’t live in any of these states that allow CCW all over but I can tell you this: As a business owner, I’m going to protect myself. If the state says CCW permit people need to carry “so many millions of dollars in liability insurance if you want to CCW” then I might consider letting CCW people in the building. Otherwise, if you want to eat in your car or at home, I don’t really care. Your rights are not my problem. My rights trump yours in my place of business!

I would say “That seems to imply that you are taking legal responsibility for the safety of your customers in the event of an altercation. Is this your intent?”

I think it differs by state. In PA, signs don’t mean a damn thing. We are not breaking a law by ignoring a “no guns sign”. Some states… not so much.

I like the “No guns, No $$” approach. As a matter of fact, I intentionally frequent businesses that appreciate people keeping and bearing arms. The owner of the local pizza joint by me bought me dinner one night when he noticed my holster peaking out. And he’s straight off the boat from Italy. As I ate my Spaghetti of the Sea, he explained the gun laws in Italy to me and then asked me to take him shooting. I send everyone I know to that place now.

I don’t think it’s necessary to ‘manipulate’ someone into thinking about their stand another way, just ask them honestly, ‘Have you thought about how other customers might look at your business, because for my part, I’m not going to spend any money anywhere that denies me the courtesy of respecting my state-sanctioned right to carry a firearm.’

Because if someone is manipulated, and they find out
they’ve been manipulated, they tend not to like it very much, and they probably won’t think too highly of you or the cause you represent.

Sounds like, Ends justify the means.

Either one is bad.